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CX Files

CX Files

By: Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan
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CX Files features your hosts, CX industry analysts Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan, speaking each week to leading analysts, thinkers, and practitioners focused on managing the Customer Experience (CX). In each episode Mark and Peter talk to their guests about the future of CX, the important trends, and what customers really expect from brands today.(C) IT Decisions and Carnaby Content 2018-2026 Economics Management Management & Leadership
Episodes
  • Guillaume Luccisano - Yuma AI - The Great CX Reset: Why BPOs May Need a New Business Model

    Guillaume Luccisano - Yuma AI - The Great CX Reset: Why BPOs May Need a New Business Model
    Jun 11 2026
    The BPO Industry Isn't Dying. But It May Need to Reinvent Itself Faster Than Anyone Expected. Yuma AI CEO Guillaume Luccisano argues that customer experience providers must evolve from labor arbitrage specialists into AI orchestrators and systems integrators—or risk becoming irrelevant. For years, critics of the business process outsourcing industry have predicted its demise. First it was robotic process automation. Then conversational AI. Then Generative AI. Yet the industry survived every previous wave of disruption because technology changed the way work was delivered rather than eliminating the need for the service itself. In episode 420 of the CX Files, Guillaume talks to Mark Hillary about these changes and how BPOs may need to adapt. https://www.linkedin.com/in/guillaumeluccisano/ https://yuma.ai/ -------------- Summary: Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the impact of AI on the BPO industry, featuring Guillaume Luccisano, CEO of Yuma AI. Luccisano argues that traditional BPO models are outdated, emphasizing AI's potential to automate 100% of customer service within 2-3 years. He highlights Yuma AI's success in deploying AI agents since 2023, achieving automation rates up to 89%. Luccisano predicts a significant shift in the job market due to AI, suggesting BPOs must evolve into systems integrators to survive. He also notes the cost efficiency of AI, with interactions costing under $1 compared to $4-$8 for human agents. ---- The BPO Industry Isn't Dying. But It May Need to Reinvent Itself Faster Than Anyone Expected. Yuma AI CEO Guillaume Luccisano argues that customer experience providers must evolve from labor arbitrage specialists into AI orchestrators and systems integrators—or risk becoming irrelevant. For years, critics of the business process outsourcing industry have predicted its demise. First it was robotic process automation. Then conversational AI. Then Generative AI. Yet the industry survived every previous wave of disruption because technology changed the way work was delivered rather than eliminating the need for the service itself. But according to Guillaume Luccisano, founder and CEO of Yuma AI, this time may be different. Speaking on Episode 420 of the CX Files podcast, Luccisano argued that the traditional BPO model—selling customer service through large pools of human agents—is facing a challenge unlike anything it has encountered before. His view is stark: AI is no longer just helping agents do their jobs better. It is increasingly capable of doing the job itself. And if that trend continues, the industry will need to redefine its purpose. The End of the "Cost Per Interaction" Era Luccisano's company specializes in AI-powered customer service automation for retail and e-commerce brands. He claims some clients are already automating the vast majority of customer interactions. What has changed, he argues, is that AI is no longer limited to answering questions from a knowledge base. Modern AI agents can access customer records, understand context, follow workflows, execute transactions, and complete tasks. In other words, they are moving beyond information retrieval and into operational execution. This matters because the traditional BPO business model has largely been built around charging for human effort—whether measured in agents, hours, seats, or interactions. If AI can handle increasing volumes of customer contacts at a fraction of the cost, then the economics begin to shift dramatically. A contact that once required several dollars of human labor may eventually be resolved for a few cents in computing costs. Even if those figures are debated, the direction of travel is becoming difficult to ignore. The Problem Isn't Technology. It's Incentives. One of Luccisano's most interesting observations is that many outsourcing providers are already talking extensively about AI. The question is whether they are deploying AI to genuinely transform operations or merely adding enough AI to satisfy customer demand while protecting existing revenue streams. That creates an uncomfortable tension. A provider whose business depends on thousands of agents has little incentive to aggressively deploy technology that could reduce the number of agents required. As Luccisano noted, many providers find themselves caught between serving today's business model and preparing for tomorrow's. The challenge is not technical. It is organizational. And perhaps even existential. Why Investors Are Nervous The sharp decline in the share prices of several publicly traded CX providers has fuelled speculation about the sector's future. Luccisano believes investors are not simply reacting to hype. They are attempting to price in a future where customer service becomes significantly more automated, more efficient, and therefore less dependent on large labor-intensive operations. Whether investors have overreacted remains open to debate. But the market is clearly asking a difficult question: What ...
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    38 mins
  • David Rickard - Everest Group - Elevate Ethiopia

    David Rickard - Everest Group - Elevate Ethiopia
    Jun 4 2026

    David Rickard is a partner at Everest Group. He is based in the UK.

    David recently visited Ethiopia for the Elevate Africa event. In this conversation with Peter Ryan David gives his take on Ethiopia and Africa more generally for CX and BPO.

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/dwrickard/

    https://www.everestgrp.com/

    https://www.weelevateafrica.org/

    ---

    Africa has been talked about as "the next big thing" in outsourcing for at least two decades. South Africa became a serious global CX delivery location. Egypt built a powerful multilingual BPO proposition. Kenya, Ghana, Rwanda, and several other markets are now attracting attention as buyers look beyond the traditional offshore giants.

    But Ethiopia is starting to enter the conversation in a more serious way.

    In Episode 419 of CX Files, Peter Ryan interviewed David Rickard, a partner at Everest Group, shortly after David returned from the Elevate Africa conference in Ethiopia. The conversation was valuable because David was not offering a promotional pitch. As an analyst, his job is to look at both sides of the equation: the opportunity and the obstacles.
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    25 mins
  • CXOutsourcers 2026 - Voices From The Conference

    CXOutsourcers 2026 - Voices From The Conference
    May 28 2026

    The annual CXOutsourcers Mindshare event took place in Ottawa, Canada, earlier in May 2026 (May 18-20).

    Peter Ryan took a microphone onto the conference floor to capture ideas and comments from the delegates in Canada for this CX-focused event.

    https://cxoutsourcers.com/

    In this episode of CX Files you will hear comments from:

    Sean Duncombe - COO, Neuroframe (USA)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/seanduncombe/

    Nathalie Siphengphet - CMO and VP Strategy, NQX (Canada)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathaliesiphengphet/

    Yanique Grant - Chief CX Specialist, ElevateCX (USA)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/yaniquewagrantcx/

    Seandette Wiltshire - Founder, The Contact Hub (Barbados)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/seandette/

    Dave Rumble - various roles including Director and Chair Maistro Group and board advisor to NDH Group (UK)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-rumble-4a4a09b/

    Krzysztof Herdzik - Co-founder and Chief Expert, Nalu Experts (Poland)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/krzysztofherdzik/

    Fauad Nasir - CEO and Founder, EmpireOne BPO (Canada)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/fauad-nasir/

    Anna Yotova - Head of Innovation and co-founder, CALLBOXS (Bulgaria)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/anna-yotova-2471aa17b/

    Veronica Richards - VP at WW Calls Canada (Canada)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/veronica-richards-9b26969/

    Faye Joubert - CRO, iTalk International (South Africa)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/fayevaldajoubert/

    Terez Rijkenberg - Executive Coach (UK)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/terezrijkenberg/

    Vinay Parmar - MD, Customer Whisperers (UK)

    https://www.linkedin.com/in/vinayparmar/

    Note: the order listed here is the order the voices feature in the podcast - there is no secret formula about the order. It's the order in which Peter sent the audio files to Mark Hillary to be included in this episode.
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    28 mins
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